Why so serious?
I know this is unpopular amongst many nudists (very much so amongst specific demographics), but I just want some perspective. First of all, I know nudism is a separate and different thing from sex. Im wondering why so many nudists are vehemently against any sort of sexuality in nudism whatsoever. Now sure, theres a time and place for sex. But why should there be no exceptions for bodily functions? If a man gets an erection, its reacted to at the same intensity as if he set someone on fire. Women menstruate, but its something to never be talked about ever. Ive been targeted by many nudists on here for accepting that bodies do these (very normal) things. Ive been told I need to conform to the societal standards to make the majority of the people more comfortable. And heres the elephant in the room: were all nudists! If you want to conform to societal norms that make the majority of people comfortable, stop being a nudist. But we cant just conform because that would take away from our identities as nudists. To reel it back in, I understand that there are examples of erections being very offensive, especially at family resorts. My questions: What are we achieving by shaming normal bodily functions? What is the harm of accepting that sexuality and nudism actually do go hand in hand in some instances? What would nudism look like if we were more open and accepting of sexuality?
(Please leave arguments, targeting, and hateful comments out. I want to have genuine discussions about sexuality and nudism)
Do some real research, find out how naturism started, how they treat each other, how people enjoy it and most importantly, what its not about.
After, when you understand what naturism is, think about what you want from it.
If it doesnt offer you what you want, the you probably should look for other groups that do offer what you want.
Trying to change the beliefs of a group because you want something different is as silly as taking a tennis racquet to a golf club and demanding they put a net across the 18th fairway.
Do some real research, find out how naturism started, how they treat each other, how people enjoy it and most importantly, what its not about.After, when you understand what naturism is, think about what you want from it.If it doesnt offer you what you want, the you probably should look for other groups that do offer what you want.Trying to change the beliefs of a group because you want something different is as silly as taking a tennis racquet to a golf club and demanding they put a net across the 18th fairway.
Are you obsessed with me or something? Either contribute something meaningful and relevant to the discussion or leave me alone please.
I was a history major in college, have lived in German, have studied the history of nudism, and am glad to offer a historical perspective.
Nudism started as a modern movement in Germany around the turn of the 18th to 19th century as a reaction to the pollution, manual labor and crowdedness that urban living brought on large segments of the population found themselves in due to industrialization. Much of the focus was on athleticism and diet with many nudists exploring or mandating vegetarianism, a trend which is not well represented in American nudism today. There was also a focus on nude group physical exercise and activity, more like calisthenics than competitive sports, which I understand was necessary to offset the repetitive movements required in both factory and work in the home at the time. Life was dirty and demanding compared with our modern conveniences and weekend getaways were needed for the body mind and soul.
Nudism started in the following decades in the US for similar reasons, but perhaps more with a WASP twist as it was more exclusive to wealthier white Americans and had more religious than trade union/proletariat overtones than in Europe. Whereas it wasn't defined as "nudist," there was a strong movement of "muscular Christianity" (as in Protestant white men) who started the YMCA and preached a gospel of fitness (including naked swimming and sometimes other exercise) and wealth There were other aspects of this such as providing inexpensive housing which would be considered more socially liberal today, but it was exclusive and prejudiced and wouldn't include women or people of color for decades.
From my reading of the history of nudism/naturism, the focus on sexuality is more recent. Were people more or less sexual, or did they just not write about it? My belief is that norms at the time were more tightly defined as unwritten rules so much went unsaid. As society has acknowledged other demographic groups such as people of color and non-heteronormative sexual orientations, our personal ideas of "expected behaviors" has broadened so unwritten rules no longer apply. What's expected behaviors? It depends. Some find freedom and others find threats in that. Perhaps that's a long winded answer to your question: why so serious?
When studying "history" and honoring "tradition," I feel that it's important to dig deeper and define things from a preindustrial and even a prehistoric perspective. Here is an overview of the history of nudity: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_nudity. Men (primarily) hunted and women (primarily) gathered for hundreds of thousands of years, often naked, prior to agriculture and civilization which is a very recent development in human history. What did nudity mean then? How about in Biblical times, when clothes were valuable so fisherman and farmers worked naked? The same applies to religion, where fertility (genitalia and all) and churches were closely linked in the ancient world. Or look at how the concept of sexuality has evolved. According to my Christian faith tradition, one could say that it's wrong for teenaged girls to get drunk and have one night stands out on the town. Following the example of Lot's daughters, for example, they should get their dad drunk and have sex with him instead, and all for the reason of getting pregnant to help the tribe survive. I'm not saying the OT is advocating incest, though it doesn't condemn it. I am saying that we need to look at a broader context before we make any definitive statements, and a "perhaps" qualifier is always justified. We never really know.
The history of what we call "nudism" or "naturism" is essentially a reaction to the industrial revolution. Today we are in the midst of a digital revolution and nudism will either adapt or die out in response. There is a gap between your and my generation in this regard. For some on this site, you are likely a threat to their past version of "reality." For others like me, you are a welcome view to the future, though who ever said the future would be rosy and free of conflict? The good thing is that time is on your side more than ours. In forty years you'll likely still be talking at the bar with your friends, regardless of your clothes, erections, piercings, tatts and genital jewelry. And us? We'll all be dead. Just promise me you won't be reactionary against the yet unborn misguided youth of the future as certain individuals are to you. And all shall be well.
Are you obsessed with me or something? Either contribute something meaningful and relevant to the discussion or leave me alone please. Please leave arguments, targeting, and hateful comments out. I want to have genuine discussions about sexuality and nudism)
(Please leave arguments, targeting, and hateful comments out. I want to have genuine discussions about sexuality and nudism)
I will try to have genuine discussion with but your previous interactions with me make me question the authenticity of your request.
Nonetheless lets look at the two examples you give women menstruating and other bodily functions. I wonder how many women you have seen at nude beaches or nudist resorts who highlight their vaginas during time that their are experiencing their natural menstrual flow. Probably not many if any. Why is that? Because something being natural doesnt mean it is something to put on public display. It is the same with other natural bodily functions as well.
Defecating and urinating are natural bodily functions however we a a society dont appreciate men or women clothed or unclothed carrying out those natural bodily function in a public fashion and particularly in a manner that calls attention to their behavior. So in an attempt to have reasoned discussion you requested please help be understand how or why an erections which you rightly describe as a natural bodily should be the only one exempt from the code of behavior and social conduct that we have for other bodily functions? And further why would being naked make it more acceptable or less subject to social norms?
Theres a clear generational difference in this thread. Id like to point out that attitudes can change to be more open and accepting of sexuality without only minor tweaks of outward behaviors. Second, there are no well-defined codes of behavior and social conduct related to nudism. Different resorts have different rules, and laws regarding nudity vary by state, county and government agency. Some laws focus on what body parts are exposed whereas others consider if a person is changing their clothing status. Third, we have a lot to learn form each other. Im pushing 60 and am grateful to young people for pushing my boundaries and keeping me vital. In turn, they seem to appreciate my insight on how to act with defined intentions and goals to find meaning and purpose. We all need to respect each other. Re=twice; spect=to look at or consider. Respect=first my perspective than yours, and were all wiser as a result. Have a great weekend!
i totally agree with you. The world as we know it grew us with nudity in all societies and thought not much about it. I grew up in the 1950s and when I wanted to swim at the local YMCA it was nude only, no swimsuits allowed at that time, due to the pool filtration system not accepting and having issues with swimsuit materials. No one seemed to have an issue with that. My father had no issue going nude at the father/son swim at the YMCA. When I went to the Y's Boys camp, every morning there was a nude dip in the private lake and on Sunday every single male in the camp from the camp director on down had to show up nude with their bar of floating ivory soap and towel and do some nude push ups and jumping jacks before getting into the water. Also, when I went to school in junior and senior high, after gym every guy and often the phy-ed men would get nude together in the large communal shower area. Personally I think that was a wonderful way to learn about how your young little penis would grow and that you would also get hair around your penis and other parts of your body.
SO WHAT THE HECK IS THE TRUE ISSUE HERE?
Hickguy M.D.
Theres a clear generational difference in this thread. Id like to point out that attitudes can change to be more open and accepting of sexuality without only minor tweaks of outward behaviors.!
I think you are dead wrong on this and disagree. The data that I see over and over says if anything younger generations are more inhibited about social nudity in general and have nothing by way of sexual mores like the free sex era of the sixties.
I am all for respecting someones opinion and their right to hold opinions regardless of how inaccurate they are but when people make generalized statements of option as if they are facts and provide no factual evidence to back that up I will call that out rather than let the disinformation and misinformation get circulated.
Outside of swinger resorts and pseudo nudist spot like hedonism there is no resorts that says a guy walking around with a erection is appropriate. I can say that unequivocally. That was the basis of the OP post. So to suggest otherwise only muddies the water and deflects from addressing the question.
So while you have every right to you opinion and I respect it I have every right to share facts that contradict that opinion. Especially when the OP said they were looking to have a reasonable discussion. I discussion doesnt mean convincing someone to take me side and it doesnt me a lack of respect. But a discussion can be a robust dialogue or debate and at the end of the day you dont have to accept anything I say nor vice versa but I do respect and will fight for you right to be able to say it.
Simply put. Dont be a dick.
You've captured the essence of the world's religions, and that's beautiful.
Be kind to one another.
Think of the other's perspective and speak from that rather than just your own.
Take off your clothes -not just the textiles-and feel the sun. Let go of your anxieties, entitlement and expectations to just show up.
I remember a friend who died from cancer shortly after graduating. She had just started chemo and paused and told me she wanted to just feel the wind in her hair so she'd always know how wonderful it felt.
Be the hair. Be the sunshine. Be the wind.
Don't be a dick.
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