But what disappointed me on TS was the lack of communication. Look, you are supposed to be a swinger so open to sex with (nice) strangers. But most guys there believe that this means they can get something for simply liking pics - if that. I was in swingers' clubs and got lots of offers, but I must disappoint you, none of them was something like "Howdy, nice tits you got here, let's shag". Yes guys, even in a swinging context guys need to seduce a bit... So learn to be civil, make a nice compliment, several even, before asking a lady to have sex with you.
As titillating as TS ENL sounds, sadly, this is not selling it for me. I get enough of this crap on TN.
We bemoan the lack of interaction on the TN version of ENL, but it's even stranger in the sister group. Where the activity is exceedingly low, despite great photos being posted.There, the numbers wanting membership is very very high, many requests every day.We refuse then finally let them in and then they disappear! Never to be heard from, I guess the chase of getting in the group is better than actually being in the group. They don't even view the pics, never mind hitting the like or leaving a comment.Very strange happenings.
It's not surprising. That site caters to more raunchy content, it's essentially just a porn gallery. Have you looked at the likes, views, and comment ratios on most porn sites? It's common to see videos with millions of views with only dozens of comments, so the rate of interaction on TS tracks. The comment section is the last reason why people are there, LOL.
Richie, not sure that these topics that we (ok, mostly I) launch here are more TS than TN just as I am not sure that sexually explicit pics are. I am of the belief that nudists have a sex life (or well, some aspire to have one) and this is not swinging (although many, if not most nudist guys would likely swing if the occasion presented itself).
Swinging is having sex with various non-romantic, usually unknown partners. Having sex with your partner is not swinging; neither is speaking about it. Nor showing sex pics/videos as Jeanne does. Not saying that Jeanne does or does not swing here, just that her sharing sexually explicit images with her hubby constitutes swinging. You may call this exhibitionism, maybe candaulism (not the French interpretation of the word!), whatever you like, not swinging.
I do understand why certain naturists want to hide everything even remotely linked to sex from the sight. Because despite their protestations, we are sexual animals, there can be some eroticism in nudity and it's a slippery slope... But I find this quite Tartuffian. Sex is part of a naturist's like and we can be open and sincere about everything as nudists except this? Why?
And yes, elegance is about being and feeling attractive. Attraction comes from the ancestral urge to mate, without which none of us would be chatting here about how discussing about sex is not nudist-like, but swinger-like. And TN stands for True Nudists, not True Naturists. So if we are open about it, nude elegance will eventually have a note of eroticism, you like it or not. And speaking about it does not make us swingers or bad nudists methinks.
Richie, not sure that these topics that we (ok, mostly I) launch here are more TS than TN just as I am not sure that sexually explicit pics are. I am of the belief that nudists have a sex life (or well, some aspire to have one) and this is not swinging (although many, if not most nudist guys would likely swing if the occasion presented itself).Swinging is having sex with various non-romantic, usually unknown partners. Having sex with your partner is not swinging; neither is speaking about it. Nor showing sex pics/videos as Jeanne does. Not saying that Jeanne does or does not swing here, just that her sharing sexually explicit images with her hubby constitutes swinging. You may call this exhibitionism, maybe candaulism (not the French interpretation of the word!), whatever you like, not swinging.I do understand why certain naturists want to hide everything even remotely linked to sex from the sight. Because despite their protestations, we are sexual animals, there can be some eroticism in nudity and it's a slippery slope... But I find this quite Tartuffian. Sex is part of a naturist's like and we can be open and sincere about everything as nudists except this? Why?And yes, elegance is about being and feeling attractive. Attraction comes from the ancestral urge to mate, without which none of us would be chatting here about how discussing about sex is not nudist-like, but swinger-like. And TN stands for True Nudists, not True Naturists. So if we are open about it, nude elegance will eventually have a note of eroticism, you like it or not. And speaking about it does not make us swingers or bad nudists methinks.
I do not disagree Flora, and I stand corrected about the exactness of the TS site, though I wasn't really referring to swinging aspect of TS, i was referring to the nature of the photos on the ENL album which aren't really swinging photos, in the main, just a little more unrestricted than photos in the TN ENL album.
My reference was... are the photos on ENL TS more risqu than, say, some of the topics we discuss here? I would argue they are not, but if course that isn't saying we discuss swinging or any aspect of the lifestyle,
Humble Richie x
I thought that the pictures being posted on TN ENL were not that explicit. Everyone was okay with them, but the mods were deleting them.
So switching them to TS , saved them from going away for no reason. But then also getting those more risky pictures posted. (Thank you J for those beautiful life moments).
Mods were the problem on TN !
Have the problems continued on TS ?
Quoted question below from lovely FLora, and my humble answer follows:Sex is part of a naturist's [life] and we can be open and sincere about everything as nudists except this? Why?
Yes, with respect, there is a need for us TN patrons to abstain from always making nudism into a sexual experience at its core. Nudity as part of a social situation is a curiosity to the world of clothed people, and possibly a mentally forbidding place most of them will never venture. And as mentioned elsewhere in this thread, there are a godzillion places on the web for people interested in that side of the story to go - for naked sexual content. TN is one of the few places in my online experience where we do attempt to put our best bare foot forward, where those who live clothed but want to know more about what makes a nudist/naturist tick can visit, and witness a natural way of living without the encumbrance of cloth but also without the intrusion of the constantly present, below-the-waistline thinking which need not be a constant companion to it.
I enjoy the open exchange here in ENL, and don't need to go to the TS version for comparison. Here, where we can find stories and queries about the sensual aspects of bareness among adults, content that in many ways does keep the mind vibrant and on its toes. I do as well appreciate how attentive the overall community is to maintaining a balance between being nude and going lewd (I went for the rhyme - couldn't resist - knowing some can and will gripe about my word usage).
It is my heartfelt desire to bring the practice of social nudism out of the sagging, worn out bra of inherent sexual intrigue, lift it up and out and into the light of the truth, trying to find that (at times) elusive but natural separation, between the hills of pulsating twerk and a mother's mammary glands giving succor to the growing child of wholesome nudism. It is a challenge to make the ones who cannot stop waving their stiff dicks around on the nude beach to better understand that what we want - no, what we need - the rest of the world to see; it is vibrant, fully-accepted, social bareness for the public. It needs none of the sexual content, and by it consistently ending up here, there and everywhere else online, and for whatever reason, no nudism-curious minds will be enlightened, and doors into expanding nude beaches and family-oriented nudist resorts will be thrown shut. There needs to be a safe harbor for the non-prurient among us to engage and enthuse the curious clothiers.
Does the sexual sometimes enter in to nudist activities? Of course. Acknowledgement of our wants and needs and their fulfillment should be accepted and tolerated -- in proper context -- when the subject cums up (juicy spelling intended). A place for that content is almost everywhere and is easy to locate, even when a person doesn't specifically look for it.
Oh ok. I got it. We need to claim that we live off sunlight and clean air and multiply by parthenogenesis so that we attract more people who actually multiply by sexual relations but either are too shy to admit it or don't actually like it. Makes sense.
Several months ago, I clicked on the Blog tab and listened to the podcast that is still there about the history of True Nudists. One of the revealing comments of the creators of TN was that they had to separate the site into TN and TS because of the conflict between members who focused on the value of nudist lifestyle and those members who focused on the sexual benefits they could derive. The majority of the comments here on this thread corroborate that. Like most responders, i am not interested in swinging, but I do like the idea of being able to ditch clothes once a while (or as often as possible) and live in the what-you-see-is-what-you-get moment (excluding sex) and be around other people who also want to be in the WYSIWYG moment with you. And that, dear reader, is what attracts me to TN rather than TS.
Fair enough AlaskaJoe, but what attracted you to a group called Elegant Nudist Ladies rather than one called Pure Natural Certified Naturists?
I created this group because I made a search and realised that the word elegance/elegant appeared neither in the title nor in the description of any of the 5,000 groups. And I think that many, if not most ladies still care about a modicum of elegance even in the nudist world. And elegance is a form of flirting, of looking better than usual, of feeling attractive, even desirable... The moment my lipstick touches my lips or your shaver touches your underarm we are no longer in the realm of WYSIWYG.
I was indeed hoping that I would attract other women and exchange tricks of the nude elegance trade, but as in all the other groups the overwhelming majority of members are male so I started to tell stories. There are many ways to tell a story and I said dozens of time that I do slightly embellish some of mine.
Let's take my last story, that of dancing naked on nar tables. It could also have gone like this:
One evening, I danced naked on bar tables in Nude City, Cap d'Agde, to celebrate naturist freedom, friendship and sincerity among naturists. Everybody applauded my action as they saw it as a proof of trust and what they saw was what they got, the real me, undisguised and unhidden. A truly naturist, innocent moment.
And maybe that was all and I was just imagining things because I'm a bad, perverted nudist. Or maybe I was just teasing you. Who knows. Because no, this group is not my psychotherapy, I'm not here to unveil my mind and soul together with my boobs. So no, as far as I am concerned WYSI -NOT- WYG.
Fair enough AlaskaJoe, but what attracted you to a group called Elegant Nudist Ladies rather than one called Pure Natural Certified Naturists?I created this group because I made a search and realised that the word elegance/elegant appeared neither in the title nor in the description of any of the 5,000 groups. And I think that many, if not most ladies still care about a modicum of elegance even in the nudist world. And elegance is a form of flirting, of looking better than usual, of feeling attractive, even desirable... The moment my lipstick touches my lips or your shaver touches your underarm we are no longer in the realm of WYSIWYG.I was indeed hoping that I would attract other women and exchange tricks of the nude elegance trade, but as in all the other groups the overwhelming majority of members are male so I started to tell stories. There are many ways to tell a story and I said dozens of time that I do slightly embellish some of mine.Let's take my last story, that of dancing naked on nar tables. It could also have gone like this:One evening, I danced naked on bar tables in Nude City, Cap d'Agde, to celebrate naturist freedom, friendship and sincerity among naturists. Everybody applauded my action as they saw it as a proof of trust and what they saw was what they got, the real me, undisguised and unhidden. A truly naturist, innocent moment.And maybe that was all and I was just imagining things because I'm a bad, perverted nudist. Or maybe I was just teasing you. Who knows. Because no, this group is not my psychotherapy, I'm not here to unveil my mind and soul together with my boobs. So no, as far as I am concerned WYSI -NOT- WYG.
It's a very strange term, I believe wisiwyg started as a software term for a spreadsheet many eons ago, however I'm probably digressing.
I don't honestly believe at all in wysiwyg, as the camera (and your eyes) will often lie to you, and the image passing to your brain will only be a skin deep reflection of the subject.
So what you see may not be what you get at all... take a Thai Lady-Boy... the are often simply stunning people, but if you took one home on your arm after a wonderful evenings conversation, will you really get what you initially saw? Probably not as the evening wears on, I would think, you'd get a bit more than you saw or bargained for.
Also, the skin deep image tells you nothing of the person under the skin, they may be a simply stunning "bunny-boiler" who's to know.
So no, sorry but often what-you-see... simply isn't what-you- get... much of the time.
What you know, is what you get... might be closer.
Disagreeing, probably for the sake of it.... Richie x
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