Nudist resort etiquette: does it keep us safe, or does it keep us repressed?
I've touched on nudist resort etiquette in the past; and shared my ambivalence about them.
This summer my wife and I were at TLR; and as she looked around she suddenly shared an observation with me:
"This "no-touching" thing is weird. Especially between partners. It just seems unnatural for people to go out of their way to actually not touch each other."
I was floored. Because nearly 20 years ago, my first wife made the same EXACT observation after her third or fourth nudist resort trip. Two completely different women who both expressed the same bewilderment, decades apart, at this aspect of nudist etiquette.
And then it brought back some memories (one of my many flashbacks lol!) It was one long week end, where we went to visit a nudist couple at their home. The first evening/next day we just mostly hung out at their home; socially naked outside the conventional nudist social "norms." During that time: the hugs we gave each other when we arrived were "full-body", we huddled up on the couch and sat "cheek-to-cheek" to watch TV, we lounged around in a circle on the floor - in various sitting, squatting or open-legged postures - to play board games, at one point our lady-friend bent over while picking something up and I voiced my admiration that here breasts "defied gravity" in their firmness, my wife complained that she felt she was getting fat - which our male-friend countered by saying her butt looked beautiful before giving her a "cheeky" slap on her cheek; to which my wife responded by pulling his head against her chest and messing up his hair. All this I felt was just natural, jovial interactions between friends who happened to be naked and unashamed.
The next day we went to the nudist resort. From the moment we arrived we sort of just went into "nudist resort etiquette mode." Physical contact was kept to a minimum. We were less open. I guess our minds were trained to automatically "click over" at the resort. It just felt very different. Less genuine.
That wasn't the only bewilderment my wife expressed this summer. We visited another resort; and from the moment we checked in we were handed a "laundry list" of rules. It was literally an entire page. As our host went over the entire sheet of etiquette, my wife and I looked at each other a bit dumbfounded. Was it all really necessary? It didn't really change our intent to relax and have a good time there; but I couldn't help but think: "What would a TRUE newbie think of all this?" There's a bit of a "cultish" element when the main focus of the introduction is "all the things you CAN'T do", IMHO.
I think nudist etiquette can be limited to three "rules": "Sit on a towel at all times", "Don't stare", and "Only naked in the pool and hot-tub." Anything else implies that without guidelines, people will just run wild, groping each other, taking pictures and being salacious. I think most people have enough common sense to know what "bad behavior" is.
I agree with everything you said, everything . Even as a total newbie to the social nudity lifestyle, I felt that strangeness if you will that is going out of ones way to avoid almost any and all contact. If we want others to see us as normal people. (Just naked) then normal common decency rules should be enough. The three rules you listed, yep thats all it should be... Easy as 1,2,3.
Naturist etiquette is actually quite simple.Its exactly the same as being a textile . (Apart from always have your towel with you)
Right dont know where the idea came from nudists dont touch. Just cause genuine nudists/naturists dont do full on sexual touching in public? Isn't appropriate to do that in any case.
I didn't post this in the "Sex and sexuality" section. Obviously I'm not talking about sexual touching.
On the topic of touching (which is just one element of my post), in the non-nudist world we give our friends full-body hugs. In the nudist world it's usually avoided. So it's not the same. To say: "nudist etiquette is the same as social etiquette in the textile world" is not quite accurate.
My actual point is whether etiquette - beyond the 3 - is actually helpful or meaningful.
Most resort etiquette rules are antiquated. They are there to repress us for sure.
The only other rule I'd state is; "do not take pictures of others without their permission." Seems like common sense but should be stated. Notice I didn't say, "no photo taking!" Nor did I mention cell phone use. Cell phones are here to stay and stating that you should disconnect yourself from yours is also antiquated. Do what you want with your cell phone but we keep our close because we stay in contact with immediate family wherever we are. They know what we do, know were we go and where we are at all times.
I've/we've never followed any "no touching" rule and we won't. We touch each other constantly, no matter where we are. We aren't exhibitionists, we are discreet and respectful of others but we touch each other in many non sexual ways and this being part of resort etiquette is out dated and ridiculous. Applying sunscreen to ourselves and to each other is not done as though we want to get it done as fast as possible. It's done with loving touch when done to each other. When it comes to close nudist friends and touching... we act as we do when we are clothed. Hugging, butt patting, kisses on the cheek, we do it naked as we do it clothed. I remember hugging our close nudist friends for the first time. We did the "A" frame hug, ensuring below the waist was at least 18" apart! :DDD Our female friend said to me, "that's not a hug, give me a proper hug!" I did, she gave me a tight squeeze and kiss on the cheek and that's the way we hug all the time, as does my wife and her husband. We have a genuine love for one another and we show it at resorts as we do in the privacy of our homes.
"The best defense is a good offense": Those enforcing these rules are deflecting their own rule/etiquette breaking by over enforcing etiquette and rules on others, in our opinion. Sad to say that many of these people at our club and local resorts seem to have nothing else in their lives but to be in charge of enforcing repressive rules and etiquette.
I didn't post this in the "Sex and sexuality" section. Obviously I'm not talking about sexual touching.On the topic of touching (which is just one element of my post), in the non-nudist world we give our friends full-body hugs. In the nudist world it's usually avoided. So it's not the same. To say: "nudist etiquette is the same as social etiquette in the textile world" is not quite accurate.My actual point is whether etiquette - beyond the 3 - is actually helpful or meaningful.
Interesting I didnt address my post as response to your post but rather the reply about touching being the norm across all social setting. I dont know what anyone elses experience is but that is mine people touch hug comment as they would appropriately in a "textile" setting in the naturist community I frequent. There are some thing appropriate in public and others are to be left for private. Wives and husbands and partners hug kiss or high five after a great point in a volleyball game in a casual non sexual way just as they might in a clothed situation. They only time I have seen touch cautioned is if it develops into something overtly sexual. To bad that isnt your experience
Nudony - it would be helpful to the debate if you could do two things:
(1) Post a copy of the sheet of rules if you still have it but not necessarily identifying the resort.
(2) Amend your third rule "Only naked in the pool and hot-tub" to read "nudity is compulsory in the pool and hot tub" as your wording can be misinterpreted by non USA English speakers as stating that the pool and hot tub are the only places when you can be naked.
Personally I would also include the sauna and steam room in the list of places where nudity is compulsory but that may be a matter of taste.
My own take on nudist etiquette is: "Behave as you would in the public rooms of a high class hotel."
Most resort etiquette rules are antiquated. They are there to repress us for sure.
Andy, you and I are on the same page.
I remember when my first wife was told about "posture etiquette." I also remember when she decided to reject that notion entirely and sit/lay however she felt comfortable. Did it raise some eyebrows? Probably. Did she have a right to? Absolutely.
And then there was our favorite resort, where checking in dressed was "de rigueur" and people would get naked only after having entered the pool area. Which didn't make much sense to me since the parking lot was well within the resort. After I had gotten to know the manager, I stopped by the front office one day and had a little chat with her about "where exactly" was nudity allowed. When she said "anywhere within the resort confines", I then asked her if it was ok then if I just got naked in the parking lot before checking in. She then replied (partially amused and surprised) that no one else checked in nude; but there wasn't really a good reason why I couldn't. So I had a chat with my wife about it; and the next time we visited, we got naked in the parking lot, and walked right into the front office - in the buff. The funny thing was; once we started doing it, other people saw us and started doing it too. And subsequently "checking in dressed" was no longer a thing. Sometimes when you challenge "etiquette", people start to realize it didn't really make much sense in the first place.
Reading some of the responses brought to mind that not everyone thinks about etiquette the same way. There are "followers" who "play by the rules", people who are socially conservative in the first place and will have no issue with stringent etiquette; and people who put "order" first. But some of us are more "free-spirited", more "touchy-feely" and/or less inclined to just "follow rules" without question.
And then there's the bigger question: "how do Millenials view "etiquette?" Because if they view it negatively, there are not enough "traditionalists" to keep resorts open. Fact.
Nudony - it would be helpful to the debate if you could do two things:(1) Post a copy of the sheet of rules if you still have it but not necessarily identifying the resort.
Besides the fact that that's way too much work; it's not the point of my post anyway.
And lastly, I am talking in GENERAL terms. Yes, I know there are resorts that are more "relaxed." One such resort (family-oriented too) I recently visited where I saw a couple of women tanning "spread-eagled" - with no one even batting an eye - and plenty of physical (sensual but non-sexual) contact between spouses. But it's not the norm. Neither is a full-page laundry list of rules.
Of the few "Nudist" places i have visited, Non Sexual touching is allowed as well as cameras, phones and tablets.
The only places I have been that restrict both are the hot springs. They all require that you leave your phones or other photographic devices in you car. Except for Valley View where they just request that you don't photograph anyone without their permission.
One place in particular has a reputation of the owner kicking people out for innocent physical contact between adults. My thinking is that there must have been something that happened and the law cracked down on them.